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Aaron Dessner confirms:folkloreis Taylor Swifts goth record.
Or, at least, its her most gothicrecord.
Dessner is the one to thank for all these little details.
(A pretty wild ride, he admits, sounding tired yet happy.)
(Heres a cheat sheet: Jacks songs soar, Aarons glide.)
The album was sort of finished before that.
We thought it was complete, but Taylor then went back into thefolder of ideasthat I had shared.
I think in a way, she didnt realize she was writing for this album or a future something.
She woke up and said, I agree [laughs].
These are the bookends, you know?
Its clear that the 1 is not written from her perspective.
Its written from another friends perspective.
Theres an emotional wryness and rawness,while also tothis kind of wink in her eyes.
I enjoy that about her writing.
cardigan
Thats the first song we wrote [in early May].
She said, Im just interested in what you do and what youre up to.
cardigan was one of those sketches; it was originally called Maple.
Thats when I realized something crazy was happening.
I thought it was a perfect match for the music, and how her voice feels.
It was kind of a guide.
the last great american dynasty
I wrote that after wed been working for a while.
It was an attempt to write something attractive, more uptempo and kind of pushing.
I also was interested in this almostIn Rainbows-style latticework of electric guitars.
They come in and sort of pull you along, kind of reminiscent of Big Red Machine.
Initially I was imagining these dreamlike distant electric guitars and electronics but with an element of folk.
Theres a lot going on in that sense.
Its kind of the story of this woman and the outrageous parties she threw.
Eventually, Taylor bought that house.
I think that is symptomatic of folklore, this jot down of narrative song.
We didnt do very much to that either.
Its supposed to be a dialogue between two lovers.
I interpreted that and built the song, played the piano, and built around that template.
We recorded Taylors vocals with her singing her parts but also the male parts.
Obviously, hes a dear friend of mine andcollaborator.
He said, Wow.
It didnt feel like getting a guest star or whatever.
I think they both put so much raw emotion into it.
Its like a surface bubbling.
Its believable, you know?
You believe that theyre having this intense dialogue.
He was like, Whoa!
my tears ricochet
This is one of my absolute favorite songs on the record.
Its lodged in my brain.
Thats also very important to Taylor and Jack.
Its like a beacon for this record.
mirrorball
mirrorball is, to me, a hazy sort of beautiful.
It almost reminds me of 90s-era Cardigans, or something like Mazzy Star.
It has this kind of glow and haze.
It feels really good before seven, which becomes very wistful and nostalgic.
seven
This is the second song we wrote.
Its kind of looking back at childhood and those childhood feelings, recounting memories and memorializing them.
Its this beautiful folk song.
Thats what this album is doing.
Its memorializing love, childhood, and memories.
Its a folkloric way of processing.
august
This is maybe the closest thing to a pop song.
It has this shimmering summer haze to it.
Thats an interesting contrast.
I think its just a breezy, sort of intoxicating feeling.
this is me trying
this is me trying, to me, relates to the entire album.
Its connecting a lot of things.
But I love the feeling in it and the production that Jack did.
It has this lazy swagger.
It just shows her versatility and her power as a songwriter, the sharpness of her writing.
Its a great song.
It felt like one of the songs that pulls you along.
The core of itsoundslike a folk song.
Its also kind of a sneaky pop song, because of the beat that comes in.
mad woman
That might be the most scathing song onfolklore.
It has a darkness that I think is cathartic, sort of witch-hunting and gaslighting and maybe bullying.
But again, dont quote me on that [laughs], I just have my own interpretation.
Its one of the biggest releases on the album to me.
It has this very sharp tone to it, but sort of in gothic folklore.
Its this records goth song.
A stillness, in a sense.
I first made this crazy drone which starts the song, and its there the whole time.
Its lots of different instruments played and then slowed down and reversed.
In the past, heroes were just soldiers.
Now theyre also medical professionals.
To me, thats the underlying mission of the song.
There are some things that you see that are hard to talk about.
You cant talk about it.
You just bear witness to them.
But theres something else incredibly soothing and comforting about this song.
To me, its this Icelandic kind of feel, almost classical.
My brother did really beautiful orchestration of it.
betty
This one Taylor and William wrote, and then both Jack and I worked on it.
We all kind of passed it around.
This is the one where Taylor wanted a reference.
She wanted it to have an early Bob Dylan, sort of aFreewheelin Bob Dylanfeel.
We pushed it a little more towardsJohn Wesley Harding, since it has some drums.
Its this epic narrative folk song where it tells us a long story and connects back to cardigan.
It starts to connect dots and I think its a beautifully written folk song.
peace
I wrote this, and Justin provided the pulse.
In the other parts of the composition, I did it to Justins pulse.
Taylor heard this sketch and she wrote the song.
This is one of my favorites, for sure.
Theres probably a connection there.
We didnt talk too much about it [laughs].
hoax
This is a big departure.
If you leave me in a room with a piano, I might play something like this.
I take a lot of comfort in this.
I think I imagined her playing this and singing it.
It is one of my favorites.
Theres sadness, but its a kind of hopeful sadness.
Thats both peace and hoax to me.
Thats part of how I feel about those songs because I think thats life.
Theres a reality, the gravity or an understanding of the human condition.
the lakes
Thats a Jack song.
Its a beautiful kind of garden, or like youre lost in a beautiful garden.
Theres a kind of Greek poetry to it.
Tragic poetry, I guess.
Folklore FAQ
1.
Whats the Meaning of the Album?
We didnt talk about it at first.
Its more about the narrative aspect of it.
I think its this sort of nostalgia and wistfulness that is in a lot of the songs.
That was clear to her.
But then we kept going, and more and more songs happened.
It was a very organic process where [meaning] wasnt something that we really discussed.
Or she and William Bowery would write exile, and then that happened.
There were different stages of the process.
Okay, but is it A24-core?[Laughs.]
How Much of It Is Influenced by The National?
She said that shes a fan of the emotion thats conveyed in our music.
When I sent her the folder, that was one of the main feelings.
She said, What the fuck?
How do you just have that?
She didnt write to all of it, but a lot of it, and relatively quickly.
She is a fan of the band, and shes a fan of Big Red Machine.
Maybe its subconsciously been an influence.
How Do Jack Antonoffs Songs on the Album Differ From Dessners?
I think we have different styles, and we werent making them together or in the same room.
We both could probably come closer together in a sense that weirdly works.
Its like an archipelago, and each song is an island, but its all related.
Taylor obviously binds it all together.
We actually didnt have a moodboard for the album at all.
I dont think that way.
I dont really know if she does either.
We didnt shy away from that.
Is Betty Queer Canon?
I cant speak to what its about.
I have my own ideas.
Is William Bowery Secretly Joe Alwyn?
Were close, but she wont tell me that.
I think its actually someone else, but its good to have some mysteries.
Does Taylor Explain Her Lyrics?
She would always talk about it.
The narrative is essential, and kind of what its all about.
Wed always talk about that upfront and saying that would guide me with the music.
I think that sometimes she would point it out entirely, but I would start to see these patterns.
Its cool when you see someones mind working.
