On his new album, losing Mac Miller, and theEvangeliondubbing controversy.
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Thundercat plays notes like pregnant clouds spill sheets of rain.
The riffs are dense but also affecting, spacey without ever losing sight of the ground.
I met Thundercat on a crisp February day on the Lower East Side to talk about the new album.
Last year, you toured and played on a few records.
What else did you get into?Just trying to be emotionally okay.
I had a traumatic end of 2018.
I took some time to revamp and look at myself and turn things into something else.
I changed a few things in my life.
I was recording a bit.
You know, just life changes.
How did ditching alcohol change your life?Immediately, I lost a lot of weight.
It was a bit anxious for me at first, with everything between withdrawal and emotions.
It was a lot to take on.
Everything would be coming at me pretty fast.
But I got used to it.
I found my rhythm in it.
It was how I felt about [alcohol], what it was to me.
It serves this purpose.
It turns you into a different person.
Thats why they call it spirits.
I enjoyed that very much: the unknown part, the Bukowski level.
But losing Mac was a traumatic experience.
It forced me to put things into perspective, genuinely.
And I got tired, you know?
I would go to want a drink, and I would just hear Macs mannerisms.
Id hear his sniffling and his breathing, and it would be really weird.
So I just stopped.
He once told me you two had several albums in the can.
It still feels strange.
Its been like a year and a half, but its still like …He should be here.
Did I hear his voice on your album?Yeah, the last song.
I didnt hallucinate that.
You grow up thinking once you get out of the neighborhood, youre all set.
But theres a lot of people really nervous in their prosperity right now.
If you learned how to read, youd get killed.
That trickled down culture-wise.
Even getting to a point of being okay is almost eerie.
Being able just to stand on your own two feet is scary.
I think the song is about the idea that its okay to be okay.
Theres no rules to how this stuff works a lot of the time.
Were left to make our own rules.
Its difficult to be okay.
Erykah Badu used to tell me its not a race.
Breathe, and youre usually okay.
It just may not feel like it.
How didChildish Gambinoend up on the song?
We were sitting and talking and playing, and we created this idea.
I always send Donald the music Im working on.
I know he lives in a different world, but its important to share stuff like that sometimes.
I remember he was a bit confused, like, What do you want me to do?
I was like, Theres no frame of reference.
I feel like the song speaks for itself, and he added a perfect touch to it.
You might be the only person thats thought to put Kenny Loggins and Wiz Khalifa on the same album.
A lot of these people are my real friends in real life.
Theres a natural way that it flows.
I dont really expect anything of anybody.
I take a stab at contribute to the music more than anything.
I feel like its not always mine.
This would be good if you …
It could go any kind of way.
But, at the same time, the work ethic is there between artists.
Mutual respect exists there, and we have a go at share that in the music.
I recently realized you worked on ErykahBadusNew Amerykahrecords at the same time that you were playing in Suicidal Tendencies.
The playing fast and all that stuff … it goes hand in hand with [hardcore] a bit.
It was always important to sharpen your craft.
In Suicidal, Mike [Muir] would make me stand in front.
He kicked me in the butt and made me walk out in front and take a bass solo.
Hed walk offstage, and youd either get hit with a bunch of shoes or you figured it out.
It taught me to be one with everything.
It became a bit symbiotic.
Mike invited the ability in the music.
We always are willing to renew that with each other.
Were always excited for what we have to bring to the table.
He knows that Im always looking around sharp corners in the music.
Its been about a decade, and we still have fun doing this.
As soon as we get together, we start playingMortal KombatorDragon Ball.
We never lose the excitement for what can be, even when things change.
Theres a constant excitement.
We look up and its like,Man, how long has it been?
Good Lord.We have a few dead friends.
We got beards, a couple of gray hairs.
Weve all got dreads now.
But its stillAdventure Timebetween me and Lotus.
Humorplays an important role in your songwriting.
Thats difficult in the confines of a jazz-fusion situation, if I may be reductive.
People instinctively start thinking about cosmic shit when they hear your sound.
Who are your favorite humorists in music or in comedy?Frank Zappa!
I was hoping we would talk about Zappa.Zappa was kicking ass and taking names.
Humor is a big part of life.
You wind up coming to that, and its almost comforting.
Ive done all I can do.
I cant do much more.
I wish there was more that I could do, but Im not allowed to.
It is what it is.
Its what its supposed to be.
Is that what the album title is saying?Yeah.
The joke is always waiting.
You choose to pick it up, or you dont.
A lot of the time, I prefer to laugh.
Frank Zappa was the king of that.
Eddie Harris … Of course, Richard Pryor.
Jack Black, of course.Bootymath, or Zack Fox.
I feel like Bootymath is the perfect name.
Its absurd, but its still kinda hard.Laughing is important, cause most shit dont be funny.
But theres a way to turn your head to get it there.
You have a song called Dragonball Durag.
I see you holding down theotakuhip-hop-head community, like, every day.
I dont want to play the same narrative.
Theres too much good story now.
We can do something different.Brolysback in the picture.
You couldve chosen to do aDragon Ball Supergame.
But I loveDragon Ball.
I do.Dragon Ballis life.
But I dont know about that game.Dragon Ball FighterZis ridiculous.
Arc [System Works] destroyed that.FighterZis timeless.
Its likePokemon RedandBluewhen it first came out.
Hes like anime Jesus.Brolys on the scene now.
He, to me, is definitely the strongest Saiyan.
But I love Goku in the newDragon Ball.Hes a man-child.
Who is the realest cartoon ThunderCat?
Dont say Lion-O!Of course not.
Panthro is a given.
But the realest ThunderCat?
The realest ThunderCat was Grune the Destroyer.
Grune the Destroyer could literally destroy every one of the ThunderCats.
Hes a general in the army, and hes equal to Jaga, but Jaga is a ghost.
What are your favorite funk and disco records?Im a huge Graham Central Station fan.
Graham Central Station, Slave, the Whispers … you know, the later 80s shit.
The 80s were big as hell.
I feel like that was the last era where live music was allowed to reign like that.
[Disco] plays a major role.
You gotta dance.
I think thats what Miles [Davis] was on.
Its funny you mention Shalamar.
The first piece of music I remember buying was a bootleg Jody Watley cassette tape.
Self-titled album.My dad used to play with Jody.
If it was Jaco, that was visionary.Or it was theTeenage Mutant Ninja Turtlessoundtrack on tape.
It wasNinja TurtlesorJaco Pastorius.
Its part of the pillars that make us.
The first thing that came to mind was the saying fromEvangelion: God is in his heaven.
Alls right with the world.
So its for us to figure it out.
They dont give a fuck.
They just do what they want to do.
Another cat my boy turned me on to is645AR.
I said this a long time ago:Lil Bis the Tony Williams of rap.
How do you feel about the newNetflix dub?
Do you care about dubs?I get up in arms aboutEvangelion.
I get real precious.
I get hung up on everything from animation to …
I know I need to move past it.
I bought a bootleg copy many years ago, and Im holding on to it.
They mightStar Warsthat shit.Some of the original ones have already jumped up in price.
Im one of those guys.
I will do that.
Dont be fucking my shit up.
Leave it the way it was.
Why do people do that to artists work?
Theres this mentality where we feel like we have to smooth out older art for modern sensibilities.
I dont think thats smart.
Its scary to think about what records out now will get reissued in 20 years and sound completely different.
We should leave it how it is.
Theres artistic intent in the way it is.You feel a persons soul in what theyre doing.
Thats the unfortunate reality.
Its not healthy for the art.
Shit gets passed down.
You have to hand-carry it to the generations.
This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity.
